Damn you 1998!

http://www.spinner.com/2009/02/12/limp-bizkit-returns-with-every-original-member/

Also, we can add to the debate the film director and whether or not their violent pictures are glorifying violence and sadistic behavior, or if they are simply telling a story. Again, it’s a question of whether or not we are going to hold the artist accountable for their work, or if we just view it as Entertainment and give it a pass. And, does this prevalence of violence/hate/misogyny in film/music/television add to the problem in our society, or merely reflect those problems. In my mind, it adds to it-how else can you explain the high percentage of violent crimes in the United States when compared to other civilized countries? But at the same time, I realize that view is a bit of a cop out, because mankind has always had a violent nature, long before there were inflammatory films and music. So, the debate goes on….

I’m all for artists expressing their ideas, even if I completely disagree with them. I can simply not listen/watch/care, and instead enjoy work that is more representative of my own beliefs and reflects my own world view a bit closer.

Two other things came to mind. The first was the idea that might ring similar to what you were saying: thought (or lyrics) beget action. The second dealt with an article that was floating around a few weeks back about the balance of freedom of speech in terms of shopkeepers refusing to sell records recorded by Neo-Nazi bands.

The Nazi band-thing was interesting, but not necessarily because of the main question it was asking “should retailers sell racist hate music?” or the legal and moral questions that trail that… but rather some stuff that wasn’t really touched on in any depth: implication and intent. Mentioned in reference was Ice-T’s “Cop Killer,” the related defense being ‘how can you sell cop killer but get on your high horse when it comes to selling this other music.’

Is it because retailers were separating the lyrics from the song in one case, but not the other? Maybe. But I think a lot of it has more to deal with implied intent behind what’s being said. Do people look at “Cop Killer” and honestly – ‘that guy is going to kill cops’? Some did (I imagine some still might)… some don’t. I’d side with the side that believes those words are empty. But how does that differ from an album called (this was the album quoted in the article) “Freezer Full of Nigger Heads”? I’m not saying that Em making good with Elton John on stage doesn’t mean he’s not a homophobe, but I’m also not going to say that him satirizing rape is on the same level as “Freezer” because of perceived intent. Empty lyrics don’t mean right or acceptable, and that doesn’t make them any less ugly or separate them from recognized meaning… but the implication behind the word does create a separation. If I say that I’m going to kill you, but don’t mean it, is that different than saying that I’m going to kill you while meaning it. Outside of the legal answer there, I’d say yes – based on intent. That doesn’t make my words, Ice-T’s words, Eminem’s words any less ugly, but it then comes down to a matter of taste. If you think I’m tasteless, so be it.

The flip side to that is the argument that even if you’re rapping about raping, you’re promoting and glorifying such actions: the “you are what you ingest” part of what you were saying.

No one is making the lyrics go away here – they are what they are… For sake of discussion, I’ll go back to the previous example – if I’m going to say that “Cop Killer” is an acceptable song how can I say that “Freezer” is not acceptable. Intent. Do I think it’s funny when South Park satirized the last Indiana Jones movie, saying that George Lucas and Steven Spielberg raped Indian Jones? Yeah, I do. Do I think that Eminem is funny in saying he’s got “a record of 17 rapes”? Not really, but I don’t see the intent there, taking pleasure in the destruction of innocent lives. Is he glorifying rape? No more than Cartman is. Is it in poor taste? That’s subjective, but… sure.

I’m just being consistent. I can’t say I hate something, or that its disgusting and turn around and say that it’s cool in a fairly similar context out of the other side of my mouth.

That’s where I’m coming from here.

He’s not a raping (that I know of), murdering, “diabolic villain” – but he’s also not dense enough to think that people pursue his music only because he takes a character that promotes such subject matter (if he was, he might as well be in the Insane Clown Posse). Every now and then he throws a bone of rational commentary that somehow, someway, appears to make up for all the bullshit along the way. I guess when you’re comparing Eminem to Flo Rida or something, Eminem at least appears to be “deep.”

I’ll try to liken it to my appreciation for death metal. While I’m kind of an asshole, I don’t go around queer-bashing, judging people on race, or seriously glorifying murder or rape (and while I make a lot of jokes about a lot of things, I don’t go around sarcastically glorifying murder and rape).

It could be that I’m a lazy listener, or that I lack solid judgment to a point where things are black and white enough so that I’ll dislike anything that is of questionable taste. But I like death metal for its operatic thunder, its crushing delivery and the odd culture that surrounds it. What comes with the music however is (often) misogynistic lyrics that glorify violence, murder and hold a general contempt for morality. But I can’t bring myself to wince when I hear the music because much of it makes me feel good.

And I’ll stand by that, because I like the music–I won’t defend the lyrics, won’t say they’re they’re appropriate, but I also won’t say that they should be taken seriously or that there is a blanket way to approach all music. If I want serious metal, I’m not going to listen to Gorgoroth (who is actually helmed by an openly gay vocalist) nor will I listen to Eminem.

i don’t mind white rappers, i don’t even mind eminem, sometimes. but that song makes me want to go hang out with tipper gore and try to ban rap music. the icing on the cake for this song has to be the first line, where he brags about how many rapes he’s committed. that by itself is enough to hate the song. but then there’s em’s caricature-of-a-caricature persona, a lazily ghost-written dre verse, and some weird mumble-warbling by 50.

give him ten good dre tracks to just rip on some ol’ rappin’ ’bout rappin’ shit (something i generally don’t even like that much), and i bet he could put together a great album. but this cartoon gangsta pop song stuff is just cringe-inducing.

which is, of course, a great deal.